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[The Daily Telegraph must be forgiven its lack of A-10 knowledge. At least they acknowledged us.]

By Neil Tweedie


The RAF has been forced into an embarrassing U-turn on its policy of not allowing pilots of the new Eurofighter Typhoon to fire their gun.

The service has decided to issue ammunition to future Typhoon squadrons and train pilots in using the fighter's single German-made 27mm Mauser cannon, reversing its cost-cutting edict.

<font color=red>The decision follows experience in Afghanistan showing that guns are still one of the most effective weapons when supporting ground troops.

In a scathing e-mail, a Parachute Regiment major commanding an isolated outpost described air support from RAF Harriers, which have no guns and rely on rockets, as "utterly, utterly useless".

He contrasted their performance with the support offered by US air force A10 aircraft, which are equipped with a 27mm rotary cannon.</font id=red>

At a conference last week, Air Vice-Marshal David Walker, the officer commanding No 1 Group, which includes the Harrier and the newly-forming Typhoon squadrons, said he had decided to proceed with the Typhoon gun, buying ammunition, spares and maintenance equipment.

Seven years ago, the ministry decided to dispense with the gun on all but the first 55 of the 232 Typhoons planned for RAF service, in contrast to the other nations in the Eurofighter consortium, which kept it on all ordered aircraft.

The experts argued that Typhoon did not need anything as crude as a gun. The plan would have saved the taxpayer about £90 million.

But Typhoon is designed to such fine specifications that the loss of the gun created a weight imbalance and it was finally realised that the cheaper and easier option would be to fit a real cannon.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... typh03.xml
<img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

The Second Amendment: America's original homeland security.
Ya just can’t take life too seriously, because you aren’t going to get out of it alive anyway.

_________________
\"Those who hammer their guns into plows
will plow for those who do not.\"
- Thomas Jefferson

I have always said the same, all fighters should have guns if for no other reason that when they have them no matter what's hangin' under the wings, they can still strafe.

<img src="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b343/m21sniper/RecoverAgentWIDEsmall.jpg" border=0>
<font color=yellow><i><b>"One way or another, your car is coming with me."</b></i></font id=yellow>

Air to air need for a gun can be debated but not air to ground, you gotta have a gun. Dont know if they ever considered CAS for the Typhoon, more of a Tornado kind of mission they probly figured.

"Fitz" is the tits!
Brownells calls me Aaron Burr cause the
way I'm droppin Hamilton$

_________________
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.

One should never show up at a gunfight without a gun.

The Second Amendment: America's original homeland security.
Ya just can’t take life too seriously, because you aren’t going to get out of it alive anyway.

_________________
\"Those who hammer their guns into plows
will plow for those who do not.\"
- Thomas Jefferson

If it's got a gun, it can strafe. If it can strafe, it's a CAS platform.

<img src="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b343/m21sniper/RecoverAgentWIDEsmall.jpg" border=0>
<font color=yellow><i><b>"One way or another, your car is coming with me."</b></i></font id=yellow>

wasnt that a problem in vietman? we made the Phantom to fire missles at long range (over 5 miles) to shoot down slow moving russian bombers, but noticed that the missles were no good at shooting down tight turning migs?

plus they did a study that showed most engagements were within 2 miles?

but hey, reading things on the internet doesnt make me an expert

_________________

Yeah but I think the bigger in nam was that we were plain and simply getting our proverbial arses handes to us in close.

"By this time tomorrow I shall have gained either a peerage or Westminster Abbey !" Nelson the Immortal Memory

_________________
YGBSM !

TYPHOON? EURO FIGHTER?

If they want an Aircraft that can do CAS and Strafe with the Name
"TYPHOON" the Brits already have one or did.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~fbonne/warbirds/w ... wktyphoon0

That "Old Bird" could do some CAS So you think that the Country that came up with that Kind of Aircraft Would ALWAYS HAVE GUNS

Drop the EU You Brits and MAKE YOU OWN NEW GEN FIGHTER.

IMHO

Goose



LIVE FREE OR DIE!

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>which have no guns and rely on rockets, as "utterly, utterly useless".
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

"Well no shit... rockets are "Area Weapons" I.E. it will generally kill all the desert wildlife around a target, but miss the asshole on the camel charging a Grunts Position"

Which makes this statement kind of comical, that same quote was said to me by a Buddy in the infamous Guard squadron that Thought Holding onto the 30mm Gunpods was a good idea. After 3 weeks of that nonsense. They went back to rockets, 20mm and Mk82's.

However my Kid Brother that now officialy has 4 Deployments under his Belt to Iraq in OH-58D's.says they love their new 7.62 Minigun pods. He said before the rockets were really great at clearing all the rooftops in the General area of a target, but that Gun pod does a damn good job of Clearing Conjested Hajii Traffic in the streets.



"The greatest pleasure is to vanquish your enemies, to chase them before you, to rob them of their wealth, to see their near and dear bathed in tears, to ride their horses and sleep on the white bellies of their wives and daughters."
-Genghis Khan

_________________
\"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. \"

George S. Patton

Doesn't the harrier have a 30mm pod available?

Ignorance may be bliss, but it sure ain't fun!

_________________
Evil is evil, no matter how small.

US Harriers have a semi-flush mount external 25mm rotary cannon.

UK Harriers used to have twin mauser 27mms IIRC, but i guess they took them out at some point, or i am mis-remembering.

<img src="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b343/m21sniper/RecoverAgentWIDEsmall.jpg" border=0>
<font color=yellow><i><b>"One way or another, your car is coming with me."</b></i></font id=yellow>

Twin ADEN 30mm pods.

"Fitz" is the tits!
Brownells calls me Aaron Burr cause the
way I'm droppin Hamilton$

_________________
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.

OK, so i was off by 3mm!

LOL...

<img src="http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b343/m21sniper/RecoverAgentWIDEsmall.jpg" border=0>
<font color=yellow><i><b>"One way or another, your car is coming with me."</b></i></font id=yellow>

I think ADEN, DEFA and the M230 of the Apache are all the same round, although some may be +P over the others. Good round for a helo, not so sure about fixed wing. I say throw all the other aircraft mounted guns away and replace them all with the GAU-12.

"Fitz" is the tits!
Brownells calls me Aaron Burr cause the
way I'm droppin Hamilton$

Edited by - boomer on Oct 10 2006 10:23

_________________
The only time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
I think ADEN, DEFA and the M230 of the Apache are all the same round, although some may be +P over the others. Good round for a helo, not so sure about fixed wing. I say throw all the other aircraft mounted guns away and replace them all with the GAU-12.

"Fitz" is the tits!
Brownells calls me Aaron Burr cause the
way I'm droppin Hamilton$

Edited by - boomer on Oct 10 2006 10:23
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

1800-2500 FPS projectiles hitting a Turbine powered Beer can, aint good for any jet Regardless of the "Millimeter Spec" Add in Closure Speed and ....Bitch Slap!

except for the Hawg, It's nobodies Bitch.

"The greatest pleasure is to vanquish your enemies, to chase them before you, to rob them of their wealth, to see their near and dear bathed in tears, to ride their horses and sleep on the white bellies of their wives and daughters."
-Genghis Khan

Edited by - thebigthug on Oct 22 2006 14:18

_________________
\"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. \"

George S. Patton