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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 16:50 
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Anybody know more about this?

USAF To Buy 'Hundreds' Of STOVL JSFs, Gen. Jumper Says
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Aerospace Daily & Defense Report
September 14, 2004

USAF To Buy 'Hundreds' Of STOVL JSFs, Gen. Jumper Says

The U.S. Air Force plans to buy "hundreds" of F-35 Joint Strike Fighters in the short takeoff and vertical landing (STOVL) configuration, a key general said Sept. 13, adding further clarity to the service's plans for the JSF variant.

The specific figure remains under review, said Gen. John Jumper, Air Force chief of staff.

"I can't give you an exact number, but it's going to be more than a handful," Jumper said at a press briefing at the Air Force Association's Air & Space Conference in Washington.

Current budget plans call for the Air Force to buy all 1,763 of its JSFs in the conventional takeoff and landing (CTOL) configuration, but Jumper and Air Force Secretary James Roche announced in February that the service would like to buy the STOVL variant as well to provide close air support, particularly for Army ground troops (DAILY, Feb. 13, Feb. 17). The Air Force has said since then that the number of STOVL JSFs it buys could result in a corresponding reduction in the number of CTOL F-35s it acquires.

Roche said in May that the Air Force's revised acquisition strategy for the Lockheed Martin JSF could be finalized by the end of the year (DAILY, May 17).

Also during the press briefing, Jumper and Roche said they are becoming increasingly convinced of the need to acquire an interim long-range strike system to serve as a bridge between the current bomber force and a next-generation platform, which may not enter service for more than two decades.

The Air Force asked industry for ideas on interim capabilities earlier this year and is evaluating the responses to that request for information (RFI). A bomber version of the Lockheed Martin F/A-22 Raptor has been mentioned as one option the Air Force might pursue (DAILY, May 20, May 24).

-- Marc Selinger


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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 17:25 
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This is related. Anybody have details?

(Source: Lockheed Martin; issued Sept. 14, 2004)


FORT WORTH, Texas --- Engineers have removed more than 2,700 pounds (1,225 kilograms) of unwanted estimated weight from the short-takeoff/vertical-landing (STOVL) version of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, while increasing propulsion efficiency and reducing drag. The result is an F-35 JSF design recommendation that is expected to meet or exceed all of its performance requirements.

"The F-35 is now tracking ahead of its Key Performance Parameters, and past concerns about the aircraft's aerodynamic performance have diminished," said Tom Burbage, Lockheed Martin executive vice president and general manager of F-35 JSF program integration. "Because of the design similarities among the three F-35 variants, many of the STOVL-version refinements will translate to the conventional and carrier versions, which already met their performance requirements even before the STOVL improvements were instituted."

The F-35 team anticipates final approval of the STOVL revisions when the U.S. Defense Acquisition Board meets on Oct. 14.

"We have addressed every known aspect affecting STOVL aerodynamic performance and shipboard compatibility," said Rear Adm. Steven Enewold, F-35 JSF program executive director. "We feel our proposed configuration is operationally viable. The next step is to get the trade-study results implemented into the detailed STOVL design package."

With first flight expected in August 2006, production becomes the program's central focus. All four of the first test aircraft's major subassemblies are now in work. Last month BAE Systems began assembling the aft fuselage and tails in Samlesbury, England, and Lockheed Martin started wing assembly at the company's Fort Worth plant. In May, Northrop Grumman kicked off F-35 assembly when it began making the center fuselage in Palmdale, Calif. Forward-fuselage assembly started the following month in Fort Worth. Production of control surfaces and edges will soon be under way at Lockheed Martin's Palmdale site.

Final assembly of the F-35 is planned to start next spring in Fort Worth, with completion of the first aircraft anticipated in late 2005.

The program already is preparing for the challenge of operating, supporting and sustaining thousands of F-35s worldwide. Nine countries currently are engaged in the aircraft's development and are expected to begin adding F-35s to their fleets early in the next decade. Many other nations have expressed interest in the aircraft, and the roster of international F-35 customers is likely to grow. The task of sustaining such a large number of aircraft over a geographically dispersed area for more than 40 years will be made possible by the F-35's exceptional reliability, its next-generation onboard diagnostics, its standardized and simplified maintenance processes, streamlined supply-chain management and many other advances over current fighters.

The F-35 is a next-generation, supersonic, multi-role stealth aircraft designed to replace the AV-8B Harrier, A-10, F-16, F/A-18 Hornet and the United Kingdom's Harrier GR.7 and Sea Harrier.

Lockheed Martin and its principal industrial partners Northrop Grumman and BAE Systems are employing an array of advanced and highly accurate manufacturing machines to help the F-35 achieve its goals of affordability, quality and assembly speed.

Three F-35 variants -- a conventional takeoff and landing (CTOL), a short- takeoff/vertical-landing (STOVL) and a carrier variant (CV) -- each derived from a common design will ensure that the F-35 meets the performance needs of the U.S. Air Force, Marine Corps, Navy, the U.K. Royal Air Force and Royal Navy, and allied defense forces worldwide, while staying within strict affordability targets.

Lockheed Martin is developing the F-35 in conjunction with Northrop Grumman and BAE Systems. Companies worldwide are participating in the F-35's development. Two propulsion teams, led by Pratt & Whitney and General Electric, are developing separate interchangeable engines for the F-35.

Lockheed Martin Aeronautics Co., a business area of Lockheed Martin, is a leader in the design, research and development, systems integration, production and support of advanced military aircraft and related technologies. Its customers include the military services of the United States and allied countries throughout the world.

Headquartered in Bethesda, Md., Lockheed Martin employs about 130,000 people worldwide and is principally engaged in the research, design, development, manufacture and integration of advanced technology systems, products and services. The corporation reported 2003 sales of $31.8 billion.


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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 17:25 
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Yeah, something was posted, here, on the issue of the Air Force collecting a few STOVLs back a few months ago.

In regards to the second post, I'm curious as to what A10Stress has to say on the issue. Suddenly, they've magically cut that much weight? Is that including reverting to the smaller, STOVL-only weapons bays? I'm also hesitant with supplying them to a number of our allies. Be nice to have a non-stealthy or non-tech-advanced varient to deliver to them or have them produce, just so they can't ship them off to France or some other undesirable for study.

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Edited by - Horrido on Sep 15 2004 4:32 PM


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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 17:54 
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Yes a few but not "hundreds".


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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 19:22 
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I believe the published number was 400-600, or some such. Have to find it to be sure.

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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 20:11 
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Sorry. Guess I missed that somehow. LOL

Could you tell me how the USAF determines how many aircraft to buy to support a certain number PAI(Primary Aircraft Inventory.

The USN is now using .8. They had been using .95.

Example:

24 squadrons w/ 10 aircraft each = 240 x .8 = 192 for a total buy of approx 330 aircraft. The 192 includes test, training, attrition and pipeline aircraft.

USAF squadrons of course are larger.

Now if the USAF only gets to buy 218 F/A 22s that translates to six 20 aircraft squadrons. IF they buy 277 that would be seven and a 1/2 maybe 8.

Any info on this would be helpful. Thx Rick.


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PostPosted: 15 Sep 2004, 21:04 
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No clue, I think Stress posted a link, and I'm just a literary parrot and source hound. lol

But, my impression is that the number is high, because it equates to 1/4 to 1/3 of the USAF buy, doesn't it? And it's also not to say the source isn't in error, either, or that my memory isn't skewed. Not like it matters, the Penta-gov does what the Penta-gov does, better judgment and reason be damned.

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PostPosted: 16 Sep 2004, 07:25 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Suddenly, they've magically cut that much weight? Is that including reverting to the smaller, STOVL-only weapons bays? <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

<i> The weight savings quotes undoubtedly include many changes that were identified in trade studies and approved by management to be incorporated. Some of the 2700 lbs budget is in the form of thrust increases in the lift fan system, an equivalence, if you will. Remember, these weights are not what we call "actuals" or "bookable" until the engineering is complete, and the drawings are released for manufacture. The predicted savings may not be realized.


Here's todays sweetheart press coverage:</i>

<b>Dallas Morning News: F-35 Slims Down, At Least on Paper</b> (Posted: Thursday, September 16, 2004)
<b>Engineers make about 400 design changes to cut 2,700 pounds</b>

[Dallas Morning News, September 15, 2004]

By RICHARD WHITTLE / The Dallas Morning News

WASHINGTON – Engineers have devised ways to cut 2,700 pounds from the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, on paper solving a problem that slowed the $244 billion program, Lockheed Martin Corp. and government officials said Tuesday.

"Now it's a question of trying to prove it to everybody," said Rear Adm. Steve Enewold, the program's director. The Defense Acquisition Board, a high-level Pentagon panel, must sign off on the design changes.

Lockheed Martin and its partners on the program, which aims to build a stealth fighter jet in three versions for use by the U.S. and allied militaries, already are building the first plane, with final assembly in Fort Worth, Adm. Enewold said.

The weight problem arose in the short takeoff/vertical landing version, known as STOVL, designed for the Marine Corps and the British Navy but also wanted by the U.S. Air Force.

The weight reductions were obtained by making about 400 changes in the design of the F-35, with some reducing the weight by a few pounds and others by several hundred, Adm. Enewold and Lockheed executive Tom Burbage told reporters at an annual Air Force Association convention.

The STOVL plane will be heavier than the other two versions – one for flight from long runways, another for aircraft carriers – because of a "lift fan" in its midsection and a flexible exhaust nozzle that allow the plane to hover and land vertically.

The design changes to remove weight included cutting down the size of the STOVL version's weapons bay, but the plane will still be able to carry two 1,000-lb. satellite-guided bombs and two AIM-120 air-to-air missiles, Adm. Enewold said.

"It's going to be a year before all the detailed design is complete," he said.

The first flight is expected in summer 2006 and low-rate production of F-35s is to begin the next year, Adm. Enewold and Mr. Burbage said.



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PostPosted: 16 Sep 2004, 13:54 
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Rick, you must be having a brain fart. We talked about this a lot. I even think you started it. Remember this?

http://forum.a-10.org/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=5652

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PostPosted: 16 Sep 2004, 18:00 
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Ya after I posted I racked my beer addled brain. LOL


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PostPosted: 20 Sep 2004, 08:39 
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<i>This is getting ridiculous. They are describing the Air Force STOVL as a fourth JSF type. If so, the economies of scale needed to make the STOVL unit price look decent have been abandoned. I know I said that they have to dump commonality, but I meant between the CTOL, CV and STOVL, not between two versions of STOVL. Who is running this program? It is on track for a train wreck.</i>

<b>USAF PLANS FOR FIGHTERS CHANGE:</b> The USAF's top leaders say the service will buy several wings of the short takeoff/vertical landing F-35 JSF, following the news from Lockheed Martin's engineers that the aircraft is shedding more than a ton of weight and gaining thrust. The service's vision includes changes to the basic short takeoff/vertical landing (STOVL) configuration that could be so extensive as to represent a fourth JSF version--in addition to the design for the USMC F-35B, the USAF F-35A and the USN F-35C. But program managers have adamantly rejected the notion, so far, of deviating from the stated program plan. Air Force Secretary James G. Roche says the service will buy "hundreds" of the STOVL F-35Bs in addition to the conventional takeoff and landing (CTOL) F-35As that will be bought in larger numbers. STOVL aircraft are needed to operate from short, unprepared airstrips near the front. With each wing requiring roughly 100 aircraft, the ground support force would equate to at least two wings, but more likely four or more. While Roche and Air Force Chief of Staff Gen. John P. Jumper would only say that the F-35B buy would be in the hundreds, the final number depends on how the Army reorganizes itself into smaller, more widely dispersed units, Jumper says. JSF program officials say there are options for modifying the F-35B for Air Force service. These include the installation of an interior cannon (instead of the Marine Corps' gun in a pod) and a probe for hose and drogue refueling (in addition to the boom capability) for operations with special forces, Marine Corps and British tankers. Whether that would require the Air Force to pay for development of an electrical refueling system to replace the standard hydraulic model is not yet known. Other JSF options could include development of reconnaissance, electronic attack and laser armed versions, say senior industry officials. (Aviation Week & Space Technology)





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PostPosted: 27 Sep 2004, 08:36 
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<i>Does the USAF really want this F-35B, or are they looking for a devious way to kill it? If I was a project killer, this would be the way to do it. This is the strongest indication yet of the end of the STOVL. There has got to be panic in the F-35 System Program Office.</i>

<b>USAF comments trigger debate on short-takeoff-and-landing F-35B</b> (Posted: Monday, September 27, 2004)
[Sept. 27, 2004, Aviation Week & Space Technology]

Forget Vertical
USAF comments trigger debate on short-takeoff-and-landing F-35B

By David A. Fulghum and Robert Wall, Washington

There has been a collective holding of breath as Pentagon officials await reaction to a U.S. Air Force announcement that it wants to buy hundreds of short-takeoff F-35B joint strike fighters modified to provide close air support for Army and Marine Corps ground forces.

A major unanswered question is whether the USAF version would simply have a different paint job, helping decrease the price of F-35Bs for the Marine Corps because of added production, or would become a fourth variant of the aircraft with specialized equipment and optional design components that might clear the way for more flexibility for foreign customers.

At the same time, weapons designers are still coming to grips with the decision to shrink the weapons bay on the standard short-takeoff-and-vertical landing (Stovl) F-35B. Some munitions have already been eliminated, but industry officials worry that the loss of available space could cause interference among the different weapons. For example, an industry official noted that design changes to such a confined space could cause weapons fins to strike one another.

MOREOVER, European officials are trying to assess the impact of the Stovl configuration change on their efforts. In particular, missile designers are trying to gauge how to build their future beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile (Meteor) to fit into the more confined space. Folding wings are one option being looked at, but the U.S. has been slow to share information on the new bay shape, complicating the weapon studies.

Researchers also are working on enhancements to the fighter's stealth performance. Of particular note, special materials-maker Esterline Technologies is teaming with Lockheed Martin's Skunk Works to combine the properties of its stealth coatings with materials that have the ability to withstand increased temperatures generated by high performance aircraft, says Robert Cremin, chairman and CEO of Esterline. Current stealth coatings can degrade when surface heating occurs. The new material, which Cremin believes will be ready in time for JSF, should eliminate that problem.

For a specialized Air Force version of the F-35B, yet other changes are emerging. So far mentioned by various Air Force and aerospace industry officials as possible changes to the design are: an internal 25mm. cannon (not the Marine Corps' gun in a pod), a refueling probe instead of a boom receptacle, a larger wing for greater fuel carriage and lift, as well as a modified propulsion scheme that accentuates short takeoff and landing, but avoids vertical landing. The last could allow additional thrust to be diverted into the core engine and away from the roll posts needed for stability during hovering flight.

Advocates are excited about possibilities that the new design offers to exercise the JSF design's modularity. But critics worry that such excursions will dilute the emphasis on savings and commonality.

<u>"The Air Force wants a Stovl F-35B, there's no doubt about that," says a senior aerospace industry official. "They wanted to replace all of the A-10s with them, but the Air National Guard objected. Because the ANG insisted on keeping them, the Air Force will now operate a mixed force." But they still need to replace three wings of A-10s which would require a total of about 300 JSFs to keep the logistics and training pipeline functional.</u>

The declaration also could signal an early move in the Air Force's strategy to cope with predictions of a decade of shrinking budgets and dramatic reductions in force structure.

"Next year is going to be a crunch year [for the Fiscal 2006 military budget plan]," says U.S. Sen. Joseph Lieberman (D-Conn.). "The fighter programs are going to be under intense scrutiny. I wouldn't be surprised to see a reduction in the overall buy [of] both the JSF and F-22. We are going to rob from acquisition funds to support current operations."

"The surprise is that the Air Force wants to tailor the F-35B Stovl for [itself] instead of just changing the name on the side from Marine Corps to Air Force and maximizing commonality," the industry official said. "They can't do both receptacle [boom] refueling and probe and drogue, so they will take the Marine Corps probe. But they want an internal gun. That takes up a lot of space and it will change the mold line because they will have to work around the [vertical] lift engine.

"There's also a new idea that if you can eliminate vertical landing as a requirement [while keeping short takeoff] the payload could go up," he said. Part of Lockheed Martin's weight reduction program is already planned to re-route some thrust from the wing-mounted roll posts through the core engine to increase power.

Engine makers are officially mum while awaiting word from the Air Force with some specifics about what they might want. However, informally some senior officials are at least thinking about how or whether they should add the roll post vents to the larger Navy wing to give the design extra stability during short takeoffs and landings.

Aerospace industry analysts say several factors could make a propulsion system specialized for the Air Force interesting and necessary. The Air Force wants more range on its short-takeoff version of the aircraft, so it would need to look for strategies to increase the fuel load, while decreasing consumption.

Not conducting vertical landings, for example, would help loosen performance requirements and limit the flight envelope to more fuel-efficient maneuvers. Moreover, adding the larger wing from the Navy's carrier-based F-35C would also allow the carriage of more fuel and thereby increase range or payload. Aerospace propulsion specialists say European customers have also expressed interest in the larger Navy wing. In the long term, the increased 40,000-lb.-thrust, alternative General Electric F136 JSF engine could also help an Air Force F-35 short-takeoff variant compensate for the weight of additional fuel and weapons. It is to begin testing in 2005.

"But the Marine Corps says that if the configuration changes, the price will go up. That breaks faith with affordability and commonality and could end up by not benefiting the Marine Corps at all," said the industry official.



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