WT Forums

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see type 7 we agree a lot fa--22 is a gimic. Just like the f-15c carrying bombs it aint gonna happen. we should bring the best aircraft to table not compromises.<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

I know it is difficult to see how an F-22 with small diameter bombs can do the damage an F-117 does with those kitted Mk-84's. I have seen some promotional test video for the SDB that encourages me that it will be very effective. We have already demonstrated some capability with the Mk-83 warhead JDAM (GBU-32?) dropped from an F-22. I am satisfied that the "A" part of F/A-22 is not just a sales promotion. It is useful now and will get better as a ground attack weapon.

THE RAMPTOR ENGINEERING TEAM <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
"Who cares if it works? Does it look good on the ramp?"

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????

China operates the Mainstay AEW for AWACS duties.

<i><b>"US Snipers...providing surgical strikes since 1776"</b></i>
<img src="http://www.creedmoorsports.com/images/SA9121-M21.JPG" border=0>

but in reality you have 100 f-22 the enemy airforce has 700 combat aircraft like the Iraqi did in gulf war 1. Which mission do you think the f-22 will be performing. Im my mind i can not see the airforce risking this asset to ground fire from the golden bb shot blindly over the battle field. That is the a-10, f-15, f-15, jsf arena. they can only be sucessful once airsuperiority has been secured. I think our problem is we have not fought a nation willing to commit to air battles or attack our troops from the air since korea. Even in Vietnam the north vietnamese airforce did not bomb our bases or ships. We think we live in a vacuum where the enemy is incompetant and only we control the air. Lets be realistic every enemy out there is studying our sucesses and have to come to the conclusion that they must challenge us in the air or loose. To that end they are going to buy Su-27, Mig 29, AWACs, Grippens, Mirage, Rafales, and Europfighters.

Remember Europe wants to start selling China weapons. This will greatly decrease our advantage over our enemies.

the concept is out there but thinking 20 years from now if the US Mexico relations continue to degrade due to illegal immigration, terrorist crossing boarders, and narcotics with a Europe or ally willing to supply a hostile government with aircraft what would we do. Remember historically america has had wars with mexico at different times. Lets not look at mexico now as it is now but at the end of a modernization time frame. Remember Germany during world war 1 offered to become ally of mexico--so my concept is simple we must be prepared to defenc ourselves. our enemys are playing chess to gain advantages we should not ceed the our advantages.

There are currently 13 nations that operate the SU-27.

Lord knows that the frogs<spit> will sell the Rafale to anyone with the cash.



<i><b>"US Snipers...providing surgical strikes since 1776"</b></i>
<img src="http://www.creedmoorsports.com/images/SA9121-M21.JPG" border=0>

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
There are currently 13 nations that operate the SU-27.

Lord knows that the frogs<spit> will sell the Rafale to anyone with the cash.



<i><b>"US Snipers...providing surgical strikes since 1776"</b></i>
<img src="http://www.creedmoorsports.com/images/SA9121-M21.JPG" border=0>
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

True dat. All this sturm und drang about will they / won't they sell to the PRC boils down to "Oh, hell YES, if the Reds bring us a cashier's check big enough, they can have the Louvre and everything in it."

"You are now leaving the American Sector."
- Sign at Checkpoint Charlie, West Berlin

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
but in reality you have 100 f-22 the enemy airforce has 700 combat aircraft like the Iraqi did in gulf war 1. Which mission do you think the f-22 will be performing. Im my mind i can not see the airforce risking this asset to ground fire from the golden bb shot blindly over the battle field. That is the a-10, f-15, f-15, jsf arena. they can only be sucessful once airsuperiority has been secured. I think our problem is we have not fought a nation willing to commit to air battles or attack our troops from the air since korea. Even in Vietnam the north vietnamese airforce did not bomb our bases or ships. We think we live in a vacuum where the enemy is incompetant and only we control the air. Lets be realistic every enemy out there is studying our sucesses and have to come to the conclusion that they must challenge us in the air or loose. To that end they are going to buy Su-27, Mig 29, AWACs, Grippens, Mirage, Rafales, and Europfighters.

Remember Europe wants to start selling China weapons. This will greatly decrease our advantage over our enemies.

the concept is out there but thinking 20 years from now if the US Mexico relations continue to degrade due to illegal immigration, terrorist crossing boarders, and narcotics with a Europe or ally willing to supply a hostile government with aircraft what would we do. Remember historically america has had wars with mexico at different times. Lets not look at mexico now as it is now but at the end of a modernization time frame. Remember Germany during world war 1 offered to become ally of mexico--so my concept is simple we must be prepared to defenc ourselves. our enemys are playing chess to gain advantages we should not ceed the our advantages.


<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

IMO, the F/A-22 will primarily be doing the F-22 job in future wars. Sure it can attain "air dominance" (or whatever the current term of the day is), but it still needs to <b>maintain</b> it. That means many of them will need to be maintaining an air-air profile, rather than doing any sort of air-ground. This isn't anything negative about the aircraft itself, it's simply the reality of likely future combat. What I'm getting at is that we can't be jipping funding out of other airframes and directing it all towards the F-22. The F-22 needs to be maintained, but so do other frames. And don't even get me started about the talk of F/A-22s getting into classic CAS, like I've heard some talk in circles. IMO, the F/A-22 should do what it does best.....air superiority/supremacy/dominance....and do it well so the other ground pounder aircraft can do their work.

If only Congress will cooperate.

I WONT DEBATE THE FIGHTER/ATTACK ROLE BUT THE USAF NEEDS THE C-17,WHY? BECAUSE ITS THE ONLY CARGO AIRCRAFT OTHER THAN "FRED" C-5 THAT CAN CARRY A M1 TANK.
C-141'S AINT WIDE ENOUGH AND GOOD OLD HERKY AINT EITHER IF IT COULD GET OFF THE GROUND WITH IT.

REMEMBER 1990 WHEN THE 3RD WAS TASKED FOR THE GULF,ITS WHOLE 500 MAIN BATTLE TANKS HAD TO BE DONE BY C-5'S, THATS 500 ROUND TRIPS OR 1000 SORTIES.
NOT INCLUDING ALL THE OTHER JOBS AND AIRLIFTS.
C-141 WAS USED A HELL'VA LOT,BUT IT COULDNT DO THE JOB OF CARRYING THE TANKS.
SO AIRLIFT IS A NEEDED AIRCRAFT,YOU MOVE EVERYONE WITH THESE JETS,ARMY,MARINES AND AIRFORCE NOT TO SAY CARGO!

I'VE WORKED BOTHSIDES OF THE COIN,I RATHER HAVE A WHOLE FLEET OF C-17'S,C-130'S,KC-10'S AND C-141'S FOR MEDAVAC DURING A WAR.,C-17'S TO GET THE TANKS AND CREWS OVER,KC-10'S FOR FUEL,PEOPLE AND CARGO,C-130'S FOR CARGO OVER,THEN USE THEM FOR IN AOR OP'S AND THE OLD C-141B'S FOR CARGO,LIGHT VEC. PEOPLE AND TURN THEM AROUND FOR MEDICAL MISSIONS BACK.

FRED IS TOO COSTLY,TOO BIG,TOO SLOW AND A BIG FREAKING TARGET!

GOOSE

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

type 7 your right. I have never heard of f-15c being pulled tasked to do CAS during both gulf wars. No they opened and kept lanes open for you guys to pound the shit out the enemy. In that task they did it well.