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They come from the manufacturer that way?? To the best of my knowledge, ammo troops have had a hand in the reloading of shells, and we have been re-using casings since 1976...I have one on my desk right now, dated 1976 that was pulled from a jet in April of this year...also, weapons troops can "splice" a load, so any mixture of the existing rounds is possible.

--Raven

"Work Hard, Party Hard, Hardly Sleep"

I'M GOING TO WAIT UNTIL I HEAR IT FROM A GUN LOADER.
BUT WE DID HAVE TP IN THE GULF,AND I SAW WEAPONS SPLICING AMMO CANS ON ICT'S.
THE OA-10'S THE 23TASS WERE ON OUR RAMP,BUT THEY TOOK CARE OF THEIR OWN JETS.
I DONT KNOW HOW THEY WERE LOADED. EXCEPT ROCKETS AND AIM-9'S

PRESS TO TEST

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

You guys are confusing two different issues. Splicing a load is mixing of cans, partial loads etc to make a full gun. I didn't say there was no TP in the Gulf, I said they didn't use it during combat. And lastly, the ammo troops do not mix the combat mix, it comes from the manufacturer that way. Five API shells, one HEI shell, five API shells...

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
...And lastly, the ammo troops do not mix the combat mix, it comes from the manufacturer that way. Five API shells, one HEI shell, five API shells...

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I'm not going to argue the point of how it (Cans) comes from the manufacturer but I do know (as Raven has said) the "cans" can/are reloaded in the backshop by Ammo troops and can be configed as needed. maybe there is a reg with tells how the mix can and can not be mixed but, that is a question for a ammo/weapons troop.

This is a photo of how the ammo guys get the rounds to reload the cans...

<img src="http://hogpen1.tripod.com/photos/pic83.jpg" border=0>

Ugly but well hung!

Edited by - Dice on Nov 02 2002 07:00 AM

DICE,YOU KNOW WHERE "HUTCH'S SITE IS"? "Y" HASNT ANSWERED BACK.
HUTCH WAS A GUN LOADER/BB STACKER ALL AROUND WEAPONS PUKE! A-10'S/F-16'S AND PRETTY SURE F-4'S.
I FOUND A PIC OF A ALA LAST NIGHT .THANKS TO MACK, BUT YOU CANT TELL WHATS LOADING .
I'M GOING TO DIG OUT THE PHOTO'S I GUESS.

PRESS TO TEST

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

Hmmm...come to think of it, our old LT was an enlisted ammo troop before he got his commission and became a JMO...I can ask him if I see him on Monday..

--Raven

"Work Hard, Party Hard, Hardly Sleep"

COACH,I'M NOT TRYING TO START A PISSING CONTEST OR ANYTHING WITH YOU OR ANYONE ELSE ON THIS SUBJECT.BUT MAN,I WANT TO KNOW THE ANSWER OF THE HAND MIXING OF AMMO. MY MEMORY HAS TO BE TAXED.
PLUS I ALWAYS FIND SOMETHING I FORGOT ABOUT LOOKING FOR SOMETHING ELSE.
THATS WHAT I LIKE ,I'LL LEARN SOMETHING IF NOTHING ELSE.
HAS THE DU ROUNDS ALWAYS BEEN BLACK?I KNEW THEIR WAS 2 DIFFERENT COLORED CASINGS. THEY WERE,BLACK,YELLOW AND BLUE RIGHT?
OHHHHHHHHHH! MY BRAIN IS GONE!!!!!!!!1

I HAVE FOUND 5 OTHER SITES ABOUT THE GAU-8 AND HAVE GOTTEN 3 DIFFERENT AMOUNTS
1135
1175
1150

HOWS THAT FOR INFO OR NON INFO?

PRESS TO TEST

Edited by - sgtgoose1 on Nov 02 2002 3:02 PM

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

I fly the jets, I don't load them. I'll check with my Chief on Monday and get the real answer.

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MACK YOU BFLT GUYS PROBABLY STILL REMEMBER WHEN THEY "TEST FIRED" THE GAU INTO THE P.O.L. PARKING LOT?
LUCKY FOR EVERYONE THOSE SPOTS WERE EMPTY. BUT THEN AGAIN SPUD TOLD
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I wasn't there, but I heard about it. I heard "JB" (that's MSGT JB, not Little Joe) came up on the radio, huffing and puffing, hollering "'76 shot the gun! '76 shot the gun!) <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
ME ABOUT THE A-7 SHOOTING THE 20MM ROUNDS INTO THE CONTROL TOWER.
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I never heard about that one.


-=> coming to you "almost live" from Searcy, Arkansas <=-

_________________
-=> Carroll McAllister <=-

coming to you \"almost live\" from Searcy, Arkansas

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I FOUND A PIC OF A ALA LAST NIGHT .THANKS TO MACK, BUT YOU CANT TELL WHATS LOADING .
I'M GOING TO DIG OUT THE PHOTO'S I GUESS.
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I remember seeing that photo in the file, but couldn't remember if you could tell what was being loaded.


-=> coming to you "almost live" from Searcy, Arkansas <=-

_________________
-=> Carroll McAllister <=-

coming to you \"almost live\" from Searcy, Arkansas

I put the paper online.
http://www.angelfire.com/biz5/fsflight/dupaper/1.html
I must warn you though, the images (I scanned it) are pretty big, and kinda low quality, but it's readable.

SPUD TOLD ME THE 20MM STORY.
I COULDNT TELL THE LOAD . I NEED A PICTURE OF A DS ICT SHOWNING THE ALA UP CLOSE AND COLORED WITH THE AMMO LOADING.
IF YOU LOOK IN THE A-10 WALK AROUND BOOK IT HAS A GREAT PICTURE OF THE GAU-8 ON DISPLAY AND THE ROUNDS SPEAD OUT. TO SAYS 1175-1350
WELL WHATEVER SHE HOLDS ITS OVER 1000 RDS. AND AT THE TIME THE RULE WAS THE PILOTS HAD TO KEEP 200 ROUNDS AT ALL TIMES FOR SELFDEFENSE.
WHEN FISH AND MARX'S THAT DAY WITH THE 23 KILLS CAME HOME WITH EMPTY GUNS AND WERE TOLD"YOU 2 HOLD THE NEW RECORD FOR KILLING TANKS IN ONE DAY,BUT YOUR BOTH GROUNDED FOR BREAKING THE GUN RULE. ALONG THAT LINE.
DIDNT REALLY MATTER CANN'T DO ANYTHING TO THE BIGGEST TANK ACES IN ONE DAY

WE NEED SOME WEAPONS PUKES ON THIS BOARD. WE HAVE AIRSTICK ACTUATORS,SCIENTIST,AND NOSE PICKERS BUT NO LOADTOADS,BB STACKERS,GUN PLUMBERS.
GOT TO GO FISHING FOR THEM!!!!!!!!!!.

PRESS TO TEST

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

My bad...combat mix is built up by the ammo guys at the bomb dump. Usually, this is not an issue as it has been stockpiled for many years, but in an ongoing conflict (like Desert Storm), the stockpile had to be replenished. The rounds come from the manufacturer as API and HEI, the ammo troops hand jam them into the milk bottles to be used in the ALA.

PGU-13/B HEI Yellow
PGU-14/B API Black
PGU-15/B TP Blue

Hope this helps.

HEY COACH,BUT YOU GET TO SHOOT IT!!!!!!!!!!!!! I LEARNED SOMETHING TOO.
BUT I STILL HAVENT HEARD FROM "Y"


PRESS TO TEST

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

I just stumbled upon this forum post, and figured I'd respond to one of Raven's posts. In regards to "Ammo Splicing." It's not allowed. It hasn't been for quite some time. The UALS come preloaded to us Weapons troops straight from Ammo, and we are only authorized to put those rounds into the jet. According to the TOs and AFIs, that's the way it's supposed to work. That's not to say that sometimes it doesn't happen like that, but personally I've never seen it before.

Now I may be mistaken about this because I've only worked on F-15's before, but I know that if your ammo comes from a UAL like ours does, splicing is not authorized. If you disect a gun system, and look at the "last round switch" inside you'd understand why. Cycling the gun system (as is necesarry when swapping UALS) leaves at least one or two empty elements in the system. Once these empty slots hit the last round switch, the gun system stops spinning to prevent a gun jam.

2W1/462's rule. Hey ammo: SHUT UP!

Uhh... sir.



2W1/462's rule. Hey ammo: SHUT UP!

FSPilot spotted an error in ur paper..

u've got "The depleted uranium shell, or DU shell for short, uses a radioactive material called U238"

its depleted uranium = no radioactiveness... if it was uranium then u could say that it was radioactive...

U238(DU) is still radioactive, but not enough to cause physical harm.

Technicly, FS was right.

<img src="http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sigs/snipersig.jpg " border=0>

My oh my. I go TDY for a couple of weeks and all hell breaks lose in the WT. Let me put some light of the subject for ya! First this pup of a weapons troop, "Load Toad".

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> In regards to "Ammo Splicing." It's not allowed. It hasn't been for quite some time. The UALS come preloaded to us Weapons troops straight from Ammo, and we are only authorized to put those rounds into the jet. According to the TOs and AFIs, that's the way it's supposed to work. That's not to say that sometimes it doesn't happen like that, but personally I've never seen it before.

Now I may be mistaken about this because I've only worked on F-15's before, but I know that if your ammo comes from a UAL like ours does, splicing is not authorized. If you disect a gun system, and look at the "last round switch" inside you'd understand why. Cycling the gun system (as is necesarry when swapping UALS) leaves at least one or two empty elements in the system. Once these empty slots hit the last round switch, the gun system stops spinning to prevent a gun jam
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My dear youngster weapons toad there are absoulutey no simularities between the UALS used for 20MM loading and the GFU-7. Ammo does not come from the MSA already in the loader. Read your CDC's. Splicing is exactly what the 2 and 3 man do during an ammo load. The CIU of the ALA is connected to the CNU cans. The 30mm rounds are in LTC's which are linked by "ties". The 2 and 3 man have to splice the LTC's from the CNU to the ones on the ALA with these ties. You load 575rds from one can and stop. Move the CIU to the next can and splice onto that belt of ammo and start again. While this is happening your spent brass is going into LTC's and back into the can you just loaded out of. By the the knucklehead that said we reload 30mm shells is wrong. The spent aluminum cases are turned it for recycling not reloading. If he seen a shell that said 1975 or whatever it was surplus that was finally expended.

When the A-10 first came out it could hold 1350 rds of ammo. The problem was the inner drum, "Helix", was to fragile and needed to be beefed up. GE did this but the trade off was less capacity. The system then could only hold 1174. Yes that is a weird number but that is correct. Of course you have you plus or minus in there.
Now for the combat mix controversy. I loaded tons of the crap in DS ONE and to tell the truth I cannot remember if it was 4:1 or 5:1. I do know that ammo troops process the stuff and per their TO's set the ratio. We also loaded loads of all HEI for CSAR missions during the storm.

One last thing for Toad. The last rds switch is not to prevent jams. It is for what is says. Last rd is detected, counts a predetermined number of elements and shuts the gun down.

Oh by the way my credentials for GAU-8/a gun system knowledge are this. Gun backshop, RAF Bentwaters 82-85, Gun Shop, Myrtle Beach AFB 85-86. Weapons Maintenance/Load Crew Chief, Hot Gun Super MB AFB 87-92. Same at Shaw 92-95. Attended every FTD available during that time frame for gun system. Was also Ammo augmentee at Bentwaters. Processed ammo and built up bombs during Phase II exercises.



Fender
Hands clear. All switches off, safe or normal. Gun hot or cold? No limit, you bet.

I'm way late in this post but that last post by fenderstrat is more than I know as a trade spec. I can say though, that after seeing CAPSTONE here at Nellis 4 or 5 times I can positively say that the A-10 and its gun steals the show every year. The poor tank they drag out onto the range to get shot every right lights up in a shower of sparks and is put full of hole with the burst from the mighty GAU-8. No other weapon fired or demonstarted in the USAF arsonal has such an impact when you see it light up a target. Any Hog driver will tell you that the A-10's gun is its best asset and can be adapted to kill just about anything from the bastards on the ground to the sucker F-16 in BLM that under estimates the HAWG's manuveribility.

Ugly but Well Hung

Hmmmm....I was at Capstone in 2000 and yes the A-10 stole the show. But I don't remember it shooting up a tank. I do remember that was the lowest I ever saw them jinxing around above the dirt.
Cheers

Being responsible means sometimes pissing people off.
Gen Colin Powell ret

The tank bit was 01 I think and it was quite a show.
Peace

Ugly but Well Hung

Just to confirm Fenderstrat72, he's right. A UALS for the GAU-8 would be too massive to mess with. As I'm in backshop, I can tell you that ammo fills cans. They have a modified ALA that they use for filling them and inspecting the rounds which has a loop of chute on the back, rather than the interface unit. As for load ratios, no clue. But two cans with 575 each would be 1150, not 1050.

Greetings form outside the Sane Asylum!

_________________
Evil is evil, no matter how small.

"No other weapon fired or demonstarted in the USAF arsonal has such an impact when you see it light up a target."

You so need to see a Spectre in action bro.

<img src="http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sigs/snipersig.jpg " border=0>

In response to Goose:

There is a load toad/gun plumber in this forum!. And by the way, BB Stacker is a term for those Ammo guys. You've seen 'em out on the line dropping Flare mods and struggling when they have to count higher then the number of fingers they have.

2W1/462's rule. Hey ammo: SHUT UP!