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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2005, 04:35 
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so 3 dollar pin million dollar engine makes you think of an airport area denial weapon coke cans and ball bearings--third world tech


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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2005, 07:24 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
so 3 dollar pin million dollar engine makes you think of an airport area denial weapon coke cans and ball bearings--third world tech
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

I like to think the ubiquitous 4 lb bird is the ultimate anti aircraft weapon. It has been proven effective against all types of flying machines.

It ain't the heat it's the humility.

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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2005, 07:57 
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lol kinda like going to prison what you in for. Raptor pilot well I ingested a protect spotted owl.


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PostPosted: 26 Oct 2005, 07:57 
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lol kinda like going to prison what you in for. Raptor pilot well I ingested a protect spotted owl.


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PostPosted: 27 Oct 2005, 10:24 
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[Air Force Times, Oct. 31, 2005]

By Laura M. Colarusso
Air Force Times staff writer

HILL AIR FORCE BASE, Utah — Nestled in the foothills of the Wasatch Mountains were six F/A-22 Raptors.

The gray skins of the Air Force’s newest fighter jets glinted in the sun. Maintainers preparing for the first mission of the day bustled underneath the wings of the planes, which were parked in a neat row on the flight line here with their canopies open for the pilots who would arrive shortly.

The pilots and maintainers of the 27th Fighter Squadron came here from their home at Langley Air Force Base, Va., to Utah to test their deployment skills.

As the Raptor nears the December 2005 target date for the Air Force to determine whether the new fighter is ready to go to war, the two-week test at Hill was an important one. Langley officials say the deployment isn’t a requirement for the Air Force to declare the plane operationally capable, but it will allow them to see where the new Raptor force needs to improve.

Lt. Col. James Hecker, commander of the 27th Fighter Squadron, the first unit to get the Raptor, called the deployment a big step toward understanding “what do we need more of and what do we need less of” in terms of spare parts and equipment when the squadron deploys.

“This is a huge learning deployment for us,” Hecker said. “We’ll take the lessons learned and apply them so we’re better next time.”

The deployment got off to a shaky start Oct. 15 when one of the Raptors had to turn around 200 miles into the flight because of a problem with its cooling systems. Because the aircraft travel in pairs, a second F/A-22 returned to Langley with it.

Of the six Raptors that made it to Hill on time, one had an issue with its cooling systems before the first flight of the deployment Oct. 17. Squadron officials described the problem as minor and said it was fixed by restarting the aircraft.

Prying eyes

The debate surrounding the need for the F/A-22 was on the minds of several people here, from the enlisted troops maintaining the jet to the pilots flying the sorties, some of whom were dropping ordnance from the Raptor for the first time.

And so is the scrutiny that comes along with flying the most expensive, advanced fighter jet in the world.

“I wasn’t used to the media spotlight,” said Capt. John Echols, who has been flying the Raptor for about six months. “It seems like half the time you walk out to the aircraft, there’s a camera crew.”

The attention, in part, results from the difficult development the $72 billion program has undergone. The Raptor has endured years of schedule slips and hundreds of millions of dollars of cost overruns. The Air Force, which has essentially been waiting for the Raptor for two decades, has defended the program fiercely, by touting its advanced software and engine technologies.

Questions about whether the Air Force can afford the F/A-22 continue. Defense officials cut the program last year by $10 billion in the face of budget pressures, and Pentagon officials say the service will likely have to stomach more cuts to its premier program.

“We’re very aware of the political decision being made,” Echols said.

Hecker, another former F-15C pilot, made similar comments.

“Of course there is a little pressure,” he said. “It’s probably more self-induced than anything else. … Now, am I going to be perspiring a little bit the first time I drop [a bomb]? I’d be lying to you if I told you I wasn’t.”

Air to ground

For the last couple of months, the pilots have concentrated on the air-to-ground mission.

For Lt. Col. Wade Tolliver, director of operations for the 27th and a former F-16 pilot, dropping bombs is nothing new. But the majority of F/A-22 pilots come from the F-15C community and are learning to drop bombs for the first time even as they train to fly a new aircraft.

Capt. Bill Creeden, an F/A-22 pilot, is one of the fliers scheduled to drop his first bombs this deployment. Creeden said he went through rigorous training — from academics to simulator rides to practicing bombing runs without actual bombs — before he came to Hill.

“Dropping a bomb from an F/A-22 for the first time is a pressure in itself,” said Creeden. “You don’t want to have a bad day and do something that’s not quite right.”

Langley officials are enthusiastic so far about the results of the deployment.

As of Oct. 20, the pilots had dropped 22 of the 24 bombs they planned to drop, said squadron spokeswoman 1st Lt. Elizabeth Kreft. The bombs — 1,000 pound Joint Direct Attack Munitions — that were released hit their targets, she said.

Of the two bombs that weren’t released, one had a problem with its internal computer. The second wasn’t dropped because of an in-flight emergency that caused the pilot to turn around before he could reach the range. Details of what happened weren’t immediately available.



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PostPosted: 27 Oct 2005, 11:01 
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With the "A" part of "F/A", what are we looking at in terms of loiter times, CAS (tank plinking, etc.) and the other missions the Hog does so well?

"Pilots Without Maintainers are Just Pedestrians With Leather Jackets and Cool Sunglasses."

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PostPosted: 27 Oct 2005, 13:12 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
With the "A" part of "F/A", what are we looking at in terms of loiter times, CAS (tank plinking, etc.) and the other missions the Hog does so well?
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

I would be thinking SAM plinking, command/control bunker busting, or what I have seen called "kick down the door" stuff. Also, the F-22 is not too good at loitering (duh?). It wants to go fast all the time. Tactics should make use of stealth and speed, or else other jets are better.

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PostPosted: 28 Oct 2005, 05:16 
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Safe-up the battlefield so the Hog can come in and accomplish it's mission. That's cool.

"Pilots Without Maintainers are Just Pedestrians With Leather Jackets and Cool Sunglasses."

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PostPosted: 28 Oct 2005, 05:23 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

Dice, did you happen to get the email I sent you about the Doorart?

TG out

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

Dave, I did and thanks! I knew they had painted the aircraft but didn't know about the door.

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PostPosted: 28 Oct 2005, 21:46 
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stress or dice. Am I right that the f-22 sits lower on the landing gear, than the f-15. It seems to sit lower and does this make it easier for FOD to be sucked in.


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PostPosted: 29 Oct 2005, 00:29 
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Yes it sits almost a foot lower than the F-15......a right big pain in the butt to get to the main weapon bays. You almost have to crawl on your hands and knees!

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PostPosted: 29 Oct 2005, 10:49 
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Is it even worse than the mighty ole F-4 was??

A 9mm MAY expand, but a 45 will NEVER shrink!

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PostPosted: 01 Nov 2005, 09:45 
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<b>USAF Pleased with F/A-22's First Practice Deployment</b> (Posted: Tuesday, November 01, 2005)
[Aerospace Daily & Defense Report, Nov. 1, 2005]

Marc Selinger

The first practice deployment of the F/A-22 Raptor has given U.S. Air Force crews increased confidence in the stealthy fighter, an Air Force spokeswoman said Oct. 31.

Although two F/A-22s experienced equipment problems during the exercise, the Air Force believes the two-week event, which sent Raptors from Langley Air Force Base, Va., to Hill Air Force Base, Utah, was an overall success because it helped make crews comfortable operating and maintaining the Lockheed Martin-built jet in an unfamiliar environment, said Lt. Elizabeth Kreft, a spokeswoman for Langley's 1st Fighter Wing.

"They are so happy that they were able to do this and make this happen," Kreft said.

During the exercise, F/A-22s dropped 22 inert Joint Direct Attack Munitions, all of which hit their targets, according to Kreft. The aircraft also flew over simulated surface-to-air missile sites.

During the practice deployment, one F/A-22 was sidelined with a malfunctioning avionics cooling system, and a second Raptor sustained significant engine damage when its right Pratt & Whitney F119 sucked in foreign debris during pre-flight ground operations (DAILY, Oct, 18, Oct. 25). Despite those glitches, the F/A-22 remains on track to achieve its initial operational capability in December at Langley.

The Air Force is developing plans to conduct more exercises with the F/A-22 in November and December, Kreft said.



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PostPosted: 01 Nov 2005, 10:50 
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Dont Beat me up over this but, What were they going to say" Its a pain for the Crewdawgs to work on areas,The thing "SUCKS" more than a Hoover when it comes to FOD, and that "Avonics cooling problem"
is going to start effecting every F-22 and we need to figure out a fix.

I can name several on the Hog,but thats just the nature of the Job.It wasnt the designers fault,you cant see into the future,but somethings stick out.

But they'll never ask the folks who work on them for their "Real thoughts" They'll get some "EYE Candy" LT to give out the company line while the reporters "DROOL"

If they really want to shake her down, send her on an overseas deployment to a NON USAF base or Public field.
That'll tell you if its the right plane.

Not Knocking the Jet,but the USAF when it wants something wont tell you anything but "BS and Roses"

I like the Raptor,but its not the overall answer.

Goose



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PostPosted: 01 Nov 2005, 16:33 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote> If they really want to shake her down, send her on an overseas deployment to a NON USAF base or Public field.
That'll tell you if its the right plane.

Not Knocking the Jet,but the USAF when it wants something wont tell you anything but "BS and Roses"<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>
Exactly my thoughts, Gooose

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PostPosted: 01 Nov 2005, 17:47 
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It would be cool to be on the ground floor of getting a new Jet, I was always on the "Getting Rid of side".

We all thought we would get the C-21's after the T-39'S were sent to the yard it was a big surprise when the USAF bought them over the Citations and Gave Lear a Civie contract<img src=newicons/madani.gif border=0 align=middle>
But we still had to do most of the "Launch and Recovery Etc... nothing else.
Then the C-17 was just coming on line when I left Travis,but you had to have 5yrs on C-5's or C-141's to even get looked at for the program.

But the F-22 looks like it'll be a Good fighter,the rest I dont know about.

Goose

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PostPosted: 03 Nov 2005, 10:29 
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Fellas, the comments made about the deployment and about the Raptor are legit... cause that was me. As far as the eye-candy part, that is far from the truth. Those reporters just wanted to hear about the plane, they couldn't care less who was telling them the news.
Let me know if you want to hear more about it though. And next time, if you want to get pictures inside the chain link fence, just try calling your friendly public affairs office...


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PostPosted: 03 Nov 2005, 11:13 
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<i> Another article by that guy Hodges. This blog is replete with writings by Hodges'. Did you approve this press release ellie24?</i>

<b>Raptors Land at Langley, But Pilots Are Still Flying High</b> (Posted: Wednesday, November 02, 2005)
The plane impresses those who were in the cockpit during a deployment to Utah.

[Newport News (Va.) Daily Press, Oct. 29, 2005]

BY JIM HODGES

HAMPTON -- It was midweek, and Brandon Wright was in a debriefing at Hill Air Force Base with some F/A-22 Raptor pilots who had just been invisible to people who were trying to shoot them down. They liked being stealthy when flying over surface-to-air missiles, even if it was a simulation.

"You know, you hear a lot about it ... but seeing that they got to prove that the aircraft was very capable was impressive," said Wright, a senior airman with the 27th Fighter Squadron. "You can see that they were excited."

The pilots were still excited about the Raptor's stealth capability Friday at Langley Air Force Base after finishing a two-week deployment to Hill in Utah.

"We had been told about it," said Lt. Col. Jim Hecker, commander of the 27th.

"When we saw it, it gave us a lot of confidence."

In two weeks of test runs, the radar on the ground never spotted a Raptor.

Six Raptors returned to Langley on Friday, along with one planeload of aircraft mechanics and another of equipment. Two Raptors stayed at Hill, one because foreign object damage broke an engine on the flight line more than a week ago, the other to accompany the plane when it's repaired and can come back home.

In the two weeks in Utah, the Raptors dropped 22 dummy bombs, flew in conjunction with the F-16s based at Hill Air Force Base and, most importantly, showed that they are better equipped to deal with high-altitude surface-to-air missiles - the so-called "double-digit SAMs" - than any other plane the pilots have flown.

That was particularly important to the pilots, who tend to be more concerned about SAMs than other airplanes.

"We knew a bit about what we could do, but now we have a report card on it," Hecker said of this first deployment of the Raptor.

It's a giant step toward making the 27th ready to accomplish a combat mission with the airplane by year's end.

Also on the report card is the job done by maintenance personnel, who spent 12-hour days working in a simulated combat environment.

Among the lessons they learned were things to tell civilian contractors about computer diagnostics on the Raptor.

"We learned a lot of stuff, did a lot of brainstorming and got to think outside of the box," said Staff Sgt. Nick Moran. "We came up with a lot of new procedures."

Pilots and crew members will spend the coming weeks evaluating those procedures and determining what changes to make before November and December deployments to Nellis Air Force Base in Nevada.

They will also see the 27th grow by five more Raptors - to 17 - by the end of December.

Brig. Gen. Burton Field, commander of the First Fighter Wing, the parent of the 27th, flew one of the F/A-22s back Friday after spending a week at Hill, where he worked for four years.

Field waxed effusive about accomplishments on the deployment. "We got everything done that we wanted to get done," he said. " ... We got our pilots that hadn't dropped any bombs to drop some. ... We learned a lot about how you deploy out. It was very successful, some great lessons."





It ain't the heat it's the humility.

Edited by - a10stress on Nov 03 2005 10:14 AM

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PostPosted: 03 Nov 2005, 14:18 
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It wasn't a press release, it was an article authored by Hodges. Jim actually "embedded" with us on the front end of this deployment... he rode over on the KC-10 to Hill AFB and then wrote several stories while at Hill. He flew back after about 4 days there, and wrote this follow-up story once the Raptor pilots brought back the first 6 planes.
Jim used to be a sports writer in L.A. He is still getting used to the military jargon, but he gets things right the majority of the time.


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PostPosted: 04 Nov 2005, 07:45 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
Fellas, the comments made about the deployment and about the Raptor are legit... cause that was me. As far as the eye-candy part, that is far from the truth. Those reporters just wanted to hear about the plane, they couldn't care less who was telling them the news.
Let me know if you want to hear more about it though. And next time, if you want to get pictures inside the chain link fence, just try calling your friendly public affairs office...


<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>lmfao you guys got caught talking smack and then get slammed by the PAO in question...

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PostPosted: 04 Nov 2005, 08:39 
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<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>
...And next time, if you want to get pictures inside the chain link fence, just try calling your friendly public affairs office...

<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

They know me by first name in the PA office here at Hill but, getting shots of the F/A-22 was not that big a deal to me. No offence to your unit or the Raptor itself but, I went "ugly early" and have never looked back. <img src=newicons/anim_lol.gif border=0 align=middle>

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PostPosted: 04 Nov 2005, 14:52 
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If you want to be happy the rest of your life make an ugly woman your wife--words of wisdom lol


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PostPosted: 04 Nov 2005, 17:54 
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Well I'm not above an apologize for the "Eye Candy" remark,in this case if I offended someone "I apologize".

But as far as the rest of the talk that's been going on about the Raptor I'll stick with this

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>if they really want to shake her down, send her on an overseas deployment to a NON USAF base or Public field.
That'll tell you if its the right plane.

Not Knocking the Jet,but the USAF when it wants something wont tell you anything but "BS and Roses"

I like the Raptor,but its not the overall answer.
<hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

Thats my experiance.

Goose


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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2006, 09:28 
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<b>Hill AFB Personnel To Provide Raptor Maintenance</b> (Posted: Saturday, February 25, 2006)
[Aerospace Daily & Defense Report, 02/27/2006, page 07]

GEARING UP: Personnel at Hill Air Force Base, Utah, are gearing up to provide maintenance for 18 of 21 F-22 Raptors that will be arriving for modifications in April, the Air Force says. Maintainers will develop mechanic training requirements, build a special F-22 work area, and make sure that needed parts are on hand. Experienced support personnel and technicians from thoughout the base will take part. Mike Dooner, 309th Aircraft Maintenance Group F-22 production chief, said in a statement that it is challenging to keep up with the latest weapon system technology. "But our technicians and support personnel have spent most of their careers working with new technology, so it won't be a new challenge," he said.



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PostPosted: 27 Feb 2006, 11:56 
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